<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" xmlns:creativeCommons="http://backend.userland.com/creativeCommonsRssModule"	> <channel><title>Comments on: Preliminary Court Approval of Google Book Settlement; Final Approval Hearing Set</title> <atom:link href="http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/</link> <description>We&#039;re Disrupted, We&#039;re Librarians, and We&#039;re Not Going to Take It Anymore</description> <lastBuildDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 19:03:41 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <item><title>By: Revised Google Books Settlement Gets Preliminary Approval</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-230239</link> <dc:creator>Revised Google Books Settlement Gets Preliminary Approval</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 09 Mar 2012 22:46:50 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-230239</guid> <description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] preliminary approval is already sparking all sorts of debate ranging from the scope of the settlement to options for authors who may not necessarily want to [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img src="http://cdn.dltj.org/wp-content/plugins/kramer/kramer.gif" class="technorati-balloon" alt="Kramer auto Pingback" style="border:0;" />[...] preliminary approval is already sparking all sorts of debate ranging from the scope of the settlement to options for authors who may not necessarily want to [...]</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Frances Grimble</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34593</link> <dc:creator>Frances Grimble</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 02:42:31 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34593</guid> <description>I am the self-publisher of eight books. I have opted out of the Settlement both by filling out the on-line form provided by Google and by sending a certified letter to the Settlement Administrator. One interesting point is that they have refused to tell me whether any of my works were scanned, saying that they will not release that information, &quot; to prevent people from making false claims.&quot; This is even though I told them I am not making a claim, and even though I provided a list of my works with all necessary identifying data. They say if I had agreed to the Settlement, _then_, and only then, they&#039;d tell me whether any of my works were scanned. Two of my books are appearing in Google Book Search, and I certainly did not submit them. Some people believe Google Book Search is identical to the list of works scanned but as far as I can tell, Google has never claimed any such thing.  End result: I don&#039;t know whether my works were scanned and the Settlement people say I have no right to be told.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am the self-publisher of eight books. I have opted out of the Settlement both by filling out the on-line form provided by Google and by sending a certified letter to the Settlement Administrator. One interesting point is that they have refused to tell me whether any of my works were scanned, saying that they will not release that information, &#8221; to prevent people from making false claims.&#8221; This is even though I told them I am not making a claim, and even though I provided a list of my works with all necessary identifying data. They say if I had agreed to the Settlement, _then_, and only then, they&#8217;d tell me whether any of my works were scanned. Two of my books are appearing in Google Book Search, and I certainly did not submit them. Some people believe Google Book Search is identical to the list of works scanned but as far as I can tell, Google has never claimed any such thing.  End result: I don&#8217;t know whether my works were scanned and the Settlement people say I have no right to be told.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Digitization 101: Rights holders have a limited time to opt out of the Google settlement</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34345</link> <dc:creator>Digitization 101: Rights holders have a limited time to opt out of the Google settlement</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 21:01:05 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34345</guid> <description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] on every new blog post in my RSS reader about it (and the impending settlement). Peter Murray in a recent blog post commented on Judge Sprizzo&#8217;s order granting preliminary settlement approval. Those -- rights [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img src="http://cdn.dltj.org/wp-content/plugins/kramer/kramer.gif" class="technorati-balloon" alt="Kramer auto Pingback" style="border:0;" />[...] on every new blog post in my RSS reader about it (and the impending settlement). Peter Murray in a recent blog post commented on Judge Sprizzo&#8217;s order granting preliminary settlement approval. Those &#8212; rights [...]</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Google Book Search Settlement and Library Consortia &#124; Disruptive Library Technology Jester</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34329</link> <dc:creator>Google Book Search Settlement and Library Consortia &#124; Disruptive Library Technology Jester</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:54:48 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34329</guid> <description>[...] the Southern District of New York in the case of The Author&#8217;s Guild et al v. Google Inc. The court has given preliminary approval of the Settlement, but it might still change. Defining &#8220;Institutional [...]</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the Southern District of New York in the case of The Author&rsquo;s Guild et al v. Google Inc. The court has given preliminary approval of the Settlement, but it might still change. Defining &#8220;Institutional [...]</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: the Jester</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34325</link> <dc:creator>the Jester</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 18:47:21 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34325</guid> <description>Good point -- if the Registry doesn&#039;t give rightsholders a way of opting-out of subsequent agreements, the Registry itself is likely to be the defendant in a subsequent lawsuit.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good point &#8212; if the Registry doesn&#8217;t give rightsholders a way of opting-out of subsequent agreements, the Registry itself is likely to be the defendant in a subsequent lawsuit.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Jonathan Rochkind</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34323</link> <dc:creator>Jonathan Rochkind</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 18:17:04 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34323</guid> <description>Agreed, except I suspect that the Registry would HAVE to give rights holders a way to opt out of any subsequent agreements it makes with non-Google entities.Remember, this settlement only legally applies to Google.That&#039;s why the things you highlighted in the agreement about the limitations on the Registry acting with parties other than Google: &quot;to the extent permitted by law, license Rightsholders’ U.S. copyrights to third parties.&quot;  &quot;subject to the express approval of the Rightsholders of the Books involved in such other commercial arrangements&quot;So being in the class and agreeing to the settlement won&#039;t give the Registry the legal ability to license to anyone other than Google without your permission.  They won&#039;t have the legal authority to do that without an opt-out, and may not even have the legal authority to do it on &quot;opt out&quot; rather than an &quot;opt in&quot; basis.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed, except I suspect that the Registry would HAVE to give rights holders a way to opt out of any subsequent agreements it makes with non-Google entities.</p><p>Remember, this settlement only legally applies to Google.</p><p>That&#8217;s why the things you highlighted in the agreement about the limitations on the Registry acting with parties other than Google: &#8220;to the extent permitted by law, license Rightsholders’ U.S. copyrights to third parties.&#8221;  &#8220;subject to the express approval of the Rightsholders of the Books involved in such other commercial arrangements&#8221;</p><p>So being in the class and agreeing to the settlement won&#8217;t give the Registry the legal ability to license to anyone other than Google without your permission.  They won&#8217;t have the legal authority to do that without an opt-out, and may not even have the legal authority to do it on &#8220;opt out&#8221; rather than an &#8220;opt in&#8221; basis.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: the Jester</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34321</link> <dc:creator>the Jester</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 02:40:03 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34321</guid> <description>You&#039;re right, of course, Jonathan -- the point of a class action is to efficiently extend the judgement to a large group of plaintiffs.  It is the scope of the plaintiff class that I find breathtaking.  That&#039;s the part I wonder about; is there precedence for such a large class to move through the process at what seems like internet time (four months)?You also bring up a very good point about the extent that the Book Rights Registry extends beyond the settlement with Google.  Paragraph 6.2(b) of the Settlement Agreement (page 65) says (with emphasis added): &lt;blockquote&gt;The Registry will be organized on a basis that allows the Registry, among other things, to (i) represent the interests of Rightsholders in connection with this Settlement Agreement, (ii) respond in a timely manner to requests by Google, Fully Participating Libraries and Cooperating Libraries, and (iii) &lt;strong&gt;to the extent permitted by law, license Rightsholders&#039; U.S. copyrights to third parties&lt;/strong&gt;.&lt;/blockquote&gt;The Notice of Class Action Settlement (the distilled summary of the Settlement Agreement) is even more explicit about the possibility that the work of the Registry will extend beyond Google.  This quote comes from paragraph 8(B) on page 11 (with emphasis added): &lt;blockquote&gt;The Registry will represent the interests of the Rightsholders, both in connection with the Settlement &lt;strong&gt;as well as in other commercial arrangements, including with companies other than Google&lt;/strong&gt; (subject to the express approval of the Rightsholders of the Books involved in such other commercial arrangements). &lt;/blockquote&gt;I&#039;m guessing the Registry, once it is established under the court&#039;s authority for rightsholders as defined in the settlement, can act as an agency for the rightsholders to enter into contracts with other entities on behalf of the authors/publishers that remain in the class.  As &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.theatlantic.com/unbound/forum/copyright/lessig3.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Lawrence Lessig points out&lt;/a&gt;, some contracts can supersede copyright law.  Can the contract between the Registry, on behalf of the authors/publishers, and a new digital distribution option provide effectively the same thing as the &quot;safe harbor&quot; in the Settlement Agreement?If you don&#039;t want the Registry to act on your behalf in this way, the only way to make sure that doesn&#039;t happen is to op-out of the class -- even if you like everything else in the agreement.  If you sign up for the class, it would seem that the board of directors of the Registry would be able to enter into such agreements on your behalf, and may not give the individual rightsholders a way to opt-out of subsequent agreements like it has for the Google settlement.What would be very useful, at least in my mind, would be a comparison and contrast with other rightsholder conglomerates such as BMI and ASCAP.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right, of course, Jonathan &#8212; the point of a class action is to efficiently extend the judgement to a large group of plaintiffs.  It is the scope of the plaintiff class that I find breathtaking.  That&#8217;s the part I wonder about; is there precedence for such a large class to move through the process at what seems like internet time (four months)?</p><p>You also bring up a very good point about the extent that the Book Rights Registry extends beyond the settlement with Google.  Paragraph 6.2(b) of the Settlement Agreement (page 65) says (with emphasis added):<br /><blockquote>The Registry will be organized on a basis that allows the Registry, among other things, to (i) represent the interests of Rightsholders in connection with this Settlement Agreement, (ii) respond in a timely manner to requests by Google, Fully Participating Libraries and Cooperating Libraries, and (iii) <strong>to the extent permitted by law, license Rightsholders&#8217; U.S. copyrights to third parties</strong>.</p></blockquote><p>The Notice of Class Action Settlement (the distilled summary of the Settlement Agreement) is even more explicit about the possibility that the work of the Registry will extend beyond Google.  This quote comes from paragraph 8(B) on page 11 (with emphasis added):<br /><blockquote>The Registry will represent the interests of the Rightsholders, both in connection with the Settlement <strong>as well as in other commercial arrangements, including with companies other than Google</strong> (subject to the express approval of the Rightsholders of the Books involved in such other commercial arrangements).</p></blockquote><p>I&#8217;m guessing the Registry, once it is established under the court&#8217;s authority for rightsholders as defined in the settlement, can act as an agency for the rightsholders to enter into contracts with other entities on behalf of the authors/publishers that remain in the class.  As <a href="http://www.theatlantic.com/unbound/forum/copyright/lessig3.htm" rel="nofollow">Lawrence Lessig points out</a>, some contracts can supersede copyright law.  Can the contract between the Registry, on behalf of the authors/publishers, and a new digital distribution option provide effectively the same thing as the &#8220;safe harbor&#8221; in the Settlement Agreement?</p><p>If you don&#8217;t want the Registry to act on your behalf in this way, the only way to make sure that doesn&#8217;t happen is to op-out of the class &#8212; even if you like everything else in the agreement.  If you sign up for the class, it would seem that the board of directors of the Registry would be able to enter into such agreements on your behalf, and may not give the individual rightsholders a way to opt-out of subsequent agreements like it has for the Google settlement.</p><p>What would be very useful, at least in my mind, would be a comparison and contrast with other rightsholder conglomerates such as BMI and ASCAP.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Jonathan Rochkind</title><link>http://dltj.org/article/gbs-settlement-preliminary-approval/comment-page-1/#comment-34319</link> <dc:creator>Jonathan Rochkind</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 22:49:04 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dltj.org/?p=598#comment-34319</guid> <description>Hmm, in one sense there&#039;s a precedent for this, any other class action suit ever.  That&#039;s how class action suits work, in the US. (Other countries may have quite different legal frameworks for such things).But there is one odd thing here. It would be an ordinary class action settlement if it was just about _Google_.  You can be in on this settlement with Google, or you can retain the right to sue Google independently later if you want.  That&#039;s how class action suits work. (Although since Google is promising to take down anyone&#039; stuff that asks them to, I&#039;m not sure what you&#039;d have to gain from an independent settlement, not joining in the class?)The weird thing is the Book Rights Registry. Which reminds me, wait, while the Books Rights Registry is being _set up_ as as this kind of over-arching precedent setting thing (just look at the name), the only _legal_ standing it will have is with Google specifically.  No other displayers-of-digital-text have agreed to use it. And even if they do, use of it doesn&#039;t automatically grant &#039;safe harbor&#039; status to anyone other than Google. it&#039;s just part of the settlement between Google, and those publisher&#039;s who are part of the class.Of course, we can count on it being used as a precedent, it is intentionally being set up as a template, and we can count on the publisher&#039;s organizations offering this same sort of deal (esp, use of Rights Registry == &#039;safe harbor&#039;) to lots of other people. Which is why it maybe SEEMS like such a big thing that how can this judge have the power to approve it?  But legally, all he&#039;s approving is a settlement between Google specifically and the class.There is no _legal_ safe harbor provided by the Rights Registry, even if the judge approves it. It is merely a settlement between Google and the class who is included in the settlement.It&#039;s sort of an attempted end-run around congress&#039;s failure to modernize actual copyright law for the digital world. Which, the copyright-owning-class would honestly rather they NOT do, that&#039;s a can of worms they don&#039;t want to open.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, in one sense there&#8217;s a precedent for this, any other class action suit ever.  That&#8217;s how class action suits work, in the US. (Other countries may have quite different legal frameworks for such things).</p><p>But there is one odd thing here. It would be an ordinary class action settlement if it was just about _Google_.  You can be in on this settlement with Google, or you can retain the right to sue Google independently later if you want.  That&#8217;s how class action suits work. (Although since Google is promising to take down anyone&#8217; stuff that asks them to, I&#8217;m not sure what you&#8217;d have to gain from an independent settlement, not joining in the class?)</p><p>The weird thing is the Book Rights Registry. Which reminds me, wait, while the Books Rights Registry is being _set up_ as as this kind of over-arching precedent setting thing (just look at the name), the only _legal_ standing it will have is with Google specifically.  No other displayers-of-digital-text have agreed to use it. And even if they do, use of it doesn&#8217;t automatically grant &#8216;safe harbor&#8217; status to anyone other than Google. it&#8217;s just part of the settlement between Google, and those publisher&#8217;s who are part of the class.</p><p>Of course, we can count on it being used as a precedent, it is intentionally being set up as a template, and we can count on the publisher&#8217;s organizations offering this same sort of deal (esp, use of Rights Registry == &#8216;safe harbor&#8217;) to lots of other people. Which is why it maybe SEEMS like such a big thing that how can this judge have the power to approve it?  But legally, all he&#8217;s approving is a settlement between Google specifically and the class.</p><p>There is no _legal_ safe harbor provided by the Rights Registry, even if the judge approves it. It is merely a settlement between Google and the class who is included in the settlement.</p><p>It&#8217;s sort of an attempted end-run around congress&#8217;s failure to modernize actual copyright law for the digital world. Which, the copyright-owning-class would honestly rather they NOT do, that&#8217;s a can of worms they don&#8217;t want to open.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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